meditation
What makes learning about the ultimate easier in the modern era, and what makes it harder?: Modernists
Diana A woman named Diana sat in a therapist’s office in Portland and said the sentence that begins a thousand modern spiritual journeys: "I think I need to meditate." She had left the Southern Baptist church at twenty-two after her pastor said her depression was a failure of... New Here . So I'm new here. I am an activist, I teach about plant medicines, I sell life insurance. I read tarot, I teach yoga. I am a nutrition coach and a certified personal trainer.
What do we do here?
Hi Nikki. I just joined yesterday so I'm still figuring it out as well. I'm keeping my eye on it to see if I can jump into any interesting conversations.... - Circling = Relatefulness? For a few years it has bugged me when people call Relatefulness "Circling."In Tuscon a few months ago I shared some of my frustrations.I also shared my annoyance at a recent retreat and gathering in Charlotte.Both times I was met with surprise and curiosity.People were surprised: “aren’t they the same?”People were curious: “why do I think they are different, and why does it annoy me?”Deep down, it's definitely connected with wanting to feel special and be different.And, I often see people who conflate "Circling" and "Relatefulness" miss unique aspects of each.Many Circling practitioners preference body sensations over thoughts, exclude stories or memories, and preference raw expression over attunement.Relatefulness includes both body sensations and thoughts, preferencing which is more alive. Stories and memories are cherished and celebrated when timed properly. Attunement and relational impact are held as essential to practicing relational presence alongside authenticity.I’m not saying Circling is bad. I’ve seen those perspectives unlock powerful insights and shifts in being.But I definitely am biased. For me right now, I continue to find what I see as a more inclusive, human, caring container as a better representation of what I want to be moving towards. And I’m also holding any judgements lightly, recognizing that I also just really enjoy the people who I get to practice Relatefulness with, and my judgements of "circling" are definitely missing lots of nuance.And maybe Relatefulness is "Circling". I'm not sure exactly how definitions work.But I do know that I really value the practice of Relatefulness.PS: I feel party inspired by a post Joshua Zader made a few years ago where he shared "I now see “relatefulness” as the name for that wider life practice, which both transcends and includes circling and authentic relating, as skill-building exercises." https://www.relateful.com/.../what-does-it-mean-to-be...
I personally love the way you've characterized the distinctions between the two. Though I am also biased :) We always run the risk of "the narcissism of small differences." But there's also a lot of good that happens when people have better expectations of what they're going to... Pain and suffering- the difference looks massive to me lately. Someone was rude to me earlier today. The in-the-moment impact of his words was discomfort (pain), but the suffering happens in the rumination.
The expectations I seem to be putting on myself for the quality of this post is suffering, so I'll stop here.
When I was first learning to meditate, I was an undergrad at Rice University, general manager of Willy's Pub, the bar on campus, and my dorm was the party dorm. Needless to say, I drank. A lot. I would sometimes be so hungover that I couldn't get up. So I would meditate.... Yesterday, during our tango lesson, I was feeling out of sync dancing with my wife. Our teacher shared that it was because I was moving ahead of her. I was focused more on executing the steps rather than being completely present with her and moving together. When I included her in my awareness and focused on being connected in motion, it felt so much better!
I couldn't help but think that this is another metaphor and a reminder for how I can show up better for myself. So often I prioritize my tasks, completing them, and pushing through while ignoring how my body feels, until it's too late. I'm leaving my body - 'my partner' - behind. But there are times... usually after I'm reminded that I've been neglecting my body... that I make a conscious decision to support my body with movement, good food, and rest, which inevitably supports me in being more focused and better with the tasks at hand.
So I wonder what else becomes possible when I prioritize taking care of myself while working and it becomes more of my norm.I've enjoyed this exploration with you Renee. I have several of the OpenFocus meditations. I'm going to experiment with giving more attention to the space that connects. Thinking of that gives me energy too.... Is it possible to 'focus circle' the current state of the world?
When I went through the Level Up program at Relateful.com and facilitated what was then called 'Focus or Birthday Circles', it was sometimes suggested that I as the facilitator could be the object of the meditation, instead of focusing on someone else.... A Jhana rabbit hole. Someone on X/Twitter introduced me to a meditation retreat company called Jhourneys that focuses on helping people get into Jhana states. Apparently there are different stages of Jhana. People describe them as states of euphoria, bliss, joy, and contentment that stay with you and some have shared that they have more capacity to be with the harder more challenging aspects of everyday life.
Any one have any experience with Jhanas?
Last night I listened a podcast featuring a guest who has been experiencing these states since the early 80s. (https://jhourney.transistor.fm/episodes/being-happier-than-you-ever-realized-for-no-apparent-reason-leigh-brasington) The energetic transmission was profound.
I’m really curious to learn more.
Yeah, they recommend to continue with a daily practice, and retreats when you can, like once or twice a year. They’re not an insular group (a green flag for me) - they mentioned plenty of other teachers and practices and encourage you to explore.... Atisha's Pith Instructions. So this is my first post on Uptrust. Good to be here!
I have been inspired by this teaching from Atisha (a master who taught in India & Tibet over a thousand years ago) but I wasn’t fully satisfied with any translation. So today I compared 6 different translations and made this version that resonates for me…
- The highest learning is to realize the truth of no-self.
- The highest discipline is taming one’s own mindstream.
- The highest quality is the wish to benefit all beings.
- The highest instruction is constant awareness of the mind.
- The highest medicine is recognizing the inherent emptiness and non-separation of phenomena.
- The highest activity is not conforming with worldly ways and concerns.
- The highest magic is the transmutation of passions and delusions.
- The highest generosity is non-attachment.
- The highest goodness is a calm and peaceful mind.
- The highest patience is to uphold humility in all circumstances.
- The highest effort is to release attachment to results and outcomes.
- The highest meditation is no-mind, letting go of all concepts, pretension and contrivance.
- The highest wisdom is non-fixation, seeing through all appearances and identifications.
- The highest spiritual teacher is one who points out our flaws and tells us to avoid them.
- The highest precept is that which strikes at our own shortcomings.
- The highest friends are mindfulness and introspection.
- The highest motivating factors are our enemies, obstacles, illnesses, and sufferings.
- The highest skilful means is to be free of quarrels and apprehensions.
- The highest benefit for others is to inspire them to engage in Dharma practice.
- The highest benefit for oneself is to direct one’s attention to Dharma - the nature of things.
- Atisha 982 to 1054 AD
Welcome and glad to have you here Nithya! Thank you for this. I haven’t heard of Atisha before this. Suddenly inspired to give my version in poetic tao te ching form, as a way to meditate on what’s been transmitted/expressed here… Unlearning "separation" Comes from relentless... Developmental levels embodied by famous rappers
I’ve just got three right now: Dr Dre: orange. Beats, etc snoop dogg: green. Weed with Willie Nelson, kids music (affirmation song, everybody’s different, etc) Kendrick Lamar: teal.... A Jhana rabbit hole. Someone on X/Twitter introduced me to a meditation retreat company called Jhourneys that focuses on helping people get into Jhana states. Apparently there are different stages of Jhana. People describe them as states of euphoria, bliss, joy, and contentment that stay with you and some have shared that they have more capacity to be with the harder more challenging aspects of everyday life.
Any one have any experience with Jhanas?
Last night I listened a podcast featuring a guest who has been experiencing these states since the early 80s. (https://jhourney.transistor.fm/episodes/being-happier-than-you-ever-realized-for-no-apparent-reason-leigh-brasington) The energetic transmission was profound.
I’m really curious to learn more.
To be honest it was a life changing week, in retrospect. I wasn’t dissapointed in any way to not reach Jhana, because I built inner trust that it will happen when my bodymind system is ready.... A Jhana rabbit hole. Someone on X/Twitter introduced me to a meditation retreat company called Jhourneys that focuses on helping people get into Jhana states. Apparently there are different stages of Jhana. People describe them as states of euphoria, bliss, joy, and contentment that stay with you and some have shared that they have more capacity to be with the harder more challenging aspects of everyday life.
Any one have any experience with Jhanas?
Last night I listened a podcast featuring a guest who has been experiencing these states since the early 80s. (https://jhourney.transistor.fm/episodes/being-happier-than-you-ever-realized-for-no-apparent-reason-leigh-brasington) The energetic transmission was profound.
I’m really curious to learn more.
Hey Nat. that retreat was quite a lot. I’m really glad I did it. I did not experience Jhanna, but I experiened tremendous openings to more enjoyment, more softness, and increased ability for gratitude, forgiveness, appreciation.... On Things I Loved That I Dropped. In a workshop I attended several days ago, everyone ended up sharing, one-by-one, about their experience or relationship with the subject of God (with a capital
G
). When it was my turn, I described being very young, with no training around religion or God, experiencing a very personal relationship with a God that cared about me and that was the still point at which all the chaos in my young life (and in the whole world) made sense. From this, I rested on a belief that somewhere beyond my understanding, life made sense. In many ways, this relationship not only comforted me but actually saved me.Later, in college, I was exposed to traditional Christianity and took all the traditional teachings and trappings of it on as my own. I was a devout believer and I ended up leading the bible studies, not because of my expertise, but because of my earnest belief. And then, I began to find things about this Christianity I had learned, that I could not make sense of. As the questioning grew into serious doubt, I found I could no longer believe what I couldn’t believe. Through tears, I formally broke up with the very personal God of my youth, still vibrant in my experience, because I falsely believed that I could not have my real experiential God if I could not believe in the teachings that were associated with him. It has taken my years to begin to reclaim my God (different now, much more expansive, but still experientially real), leaving behind what no longer feels integral.
There are other things that I have loved and left behind based on trappings associated with it rather than on the essence of the thing (reading fiction, singing and playing the guitar, for example). As I move toward more integration in my life, I find myself rediscovering some of those things I loved from my past. They are not the same, having been laid aside for decades, yet rediscovering them is bringing my joy.
Do you have things that you loved that you dropped because of the trappings?
I was taught some of that with the advanced meditations I learned from Samuel (my teacher at the time). That the meditations were a transmission and something bad would happen if I shared them with others that had not built up to it with the fundamentals.... A Jhana rabbit hole. Someone on X/Twitter introduced me to a meditation retreat company called Jhourneys that focuses on helping people get into Jhana states. Apparently there are different stages of Jhana. People describe them as states of euphoria, bliss, joy, and contentment that stay with you and some have shared that they have more capacity to be with the harder more challenging aspects of everyday life.
Any one have any experience with Jhanas?
Last night I listened a podcast featuring a guest who has been experiencing these states since the early 80s. (https://jhourney.transistor.fm/episodes/being-happier-than-you-ever-realized-for-no-apparent-reason-leigh-brasington) The energetic transmission was profound.
I’m really curious to learn more.
Regarding the mind’s absence of the 5 hindrances, I remember a time when I was heavily into qigong and did this training where we’d lie down with our hands and legs up in the air.... Race and IQ. I recently got dinner at a hole-in-the-wall asian spot with a geneticist named Razib Khan. Over noodles, and with a concerned glance over his shoulder, he admitted that the science is clear: race is absolutely tied to IQ. Jews are the smartest. Pretty much everyone on the continent of Africa is at the bottom.
This fact alone is controversial, but we have to be able to talk about it, and here’s why:
I nodded, and asked:
How many generations does this take to change?
Razib:
As little as three generations. For example, the Egyptians used to be the smartest, but a century of inbreeding knocked them to the bottom. Incest drops IQ by 10 points in the first generation. After that the effect weakens.
This is huge. At first glance, the controversial statement seems like a slamdunk for racists the world over. But dig into the details, and you find out 3 generations is enough to change things—this means that race and IQ are not inherently linked as far as we know, they’re just linked in today’s world, because of today’s policies and systems.
Knowing this could actually help us target where we need to focus our interventions for the next three decades. Let’s get us all up!
to the extent you trust me (which is low when it comes to "greater than" symbols < >,” I think you can! Especially in the realms of metatheory, developmental psychology, philosophy, truth claims, epistemology, meditation, mystical traditions....